Thursday, April 14, 2011

Never underestimate the power of the hamster

An intriguing little survey on re-virginizing confirms a core Game concept:
Watts engaged in a lot of prayer and thought, and now declares herself a virgin once again. “The most important thing was to realize what my values were and what I want in the future and the bigger goals in my life," she says. "That’s why I can call myself a renewed virgin....

But whether this can literally make somebody a virgin depends upon one’s point of view. When Carpenter did a study about what she called “secondary virginity,” she found wide disagreement not only about the plausibility of secondary virginity, but also about whether “virginity loss should be understood as a physiological or an emotional-experiential phenomenon.” Interestingly, of the 61 women and men interviewed, “three-fourths of men adamantly declared secondary virginity to be impossible, compared to about one-fourth of women,” though men sometimes declare that they are born-again virgins, too.
The important point to take away from this is not whether surgical or spiritual re-virginizing is possible. Of course it's not. One can no more un-lose one's virginity than un-lose one's severed arm. And while both arms and hymens can be reattached, it is obvious that a reattached arm is substantively different than one which was never severed in the first place. The scars and the memories remain.

First, a caveat. The survey is tiny and statistically insignificant. That being said, it indicates 75 percent of the surveyed women and 25 percent of the men are willing to shamelessly reinterpret sexual history in the most extreme manner possible. Now, consider how many more people will be willing to do so when the historical revisionism is a little less glaring....

This is not to say that an unwillingness to provide accurate information about one's past necessarily matters a great deal. Honesty is wildly overrated in relationships; there are things we don't even want to know about ourselves, much less anyone else. While the past behavior is an indicator of future behavior, it is not a completely reliable guide. The correct response to any female assertion about her sexual history is little more than a dubious snort and a roll of the eyes, perhaps livened by some exaggeration and amplification. There is absolutely no point in playing sexual prosecutor, much less sexual inquisitor, in order to learn more about what you already know about a woman. In most cases, she's neither a saint nor a completely soulless whore, and over the course of time she'll drop enough references to her various male "friends" from the past - and they will inevitably be described as "friends" rather than "boyfriends" unless they dated exclusively for at least six months - that you'll have a pretty good idea of where she fits on the slut scale. If you lack the ability to read a woman this way, just ask one of your alpha or sigma friends what his estimate would be.

I don't recommend for men to broach the subject at all, because if she thinks her sexual history is something you might find alarming, she'll likely bring the subject up at some point, or alternatively, inadvertantly give the game away. Just listen, note the occasional contradictions when she regales you with her stories, and eventually the picture will become sufficiently clear.

But above all, recall that Alpha Game doesn't concern itself with being first, but rather with being current, and in the case of Married Alpha Game, being last. Men of high socio-sexual rank don't worry about the past; do you imagine Brad Pitt loses sleep over whether Angelina Jolie is secretly pining away for Billy Bob Thornton or some fat little director from her casting couch days? Of course not, because he knows a) Brad > Billy Bob, and, b) if Angelina does inexplicably decide to go back to Billy Bob, he will be free to move on to a younger, hotter woman who hasn't adopted half of Turkmenistan.


indyguy77@work said...

Funny: "But whether this can literally make somebody a virgin depends upon one’s point of view."

No. No, it really, really, really does not.

modernguy said...

People just keep looking for and finding more and more excuses not to really know each other. This says something about who we really are, Christian or not.

Athor Pel said...

Every girl I've dated, slept with or married has told me things about her past that she would not have told me if I had purposefully gone looking for them.

As has been said, if you point blank ask them how many men they've slept with they will lie. But if you let them talk they will tell you stories, those stories will all add up to the real number. So LISTEN TO THE STORIES. Don't overreact but pay attention, listen for weasel words, listen for avoidance of her responsibility, listen for rationalizations.

They can't help it, it's like they're compelled to talk about themselves. From their tone of voice and how they look at you as they tell the story I've become convinced they want to know whether you will hold those things against them or not. It could very well be a type of shit test.

JCclimber said...

Here is the truly funny thing. Christ says that in Him you are a new creation. In essence, you are born again, if you are truly converted. Spiritually speaking, you're a virgin.

However, a 100% converted, new creation, does NOT lie about their past, because lying is a sin. Nor are evasions and trying to spin your past to look good in the eyes of the world.

So, the only ones who could truly lay claim to becoming virgins again, would also never, ever want to lie or mislead people to think they are a virgin (as they would be aware of how unworthy they are and how dirty their past was).

Why did I never ask my wife about her sexual past? Because I knew enough from things she said to get the general picture, AND she was a new creation in Christ and shows it in her daily actions. Also my numbers were about 10x what I estimated hers to be, so I can't point any fingers.

Lurky the Loquacious said...

Yet again, the proof that a woman can add an inch to her stature by taking thought.

black said...

"a younger, hotter woman who hasn't adopted half of Turkmenistan."

Good one.


realmatt said...

It's best to just focus on what you need to know about her which is whether she's clean and willing to be your wife and mother to your children while submitting to you and not being a horrible stupid bitch.

"Let's know each other's souls" is high school fairyland pussy-pedestal nonsense.

Athol Kay: Married Man Sex Life said...

Eeek! If she can do the mental sleigh of hand to convince herself she's a virgin again, immediately rule her out as wife material.

If she says "I stopped sleeping around once I became a Christian and I regret what I did before then. I can't undo the past but I can make a better future." then sure, that sounds more reasonable.

But "I'm a new virgin!" is a major red flag that she's capable of rewriting her personal history - which means she could also rewrite the history of your marriage and how she tried so hard but the love just wasn't ever really there.

Anonymous said...

Be aware that there is also a surgical procedure to reconstruct the hymen, allowing former sex workers, carousel riders and other sluts to 'bleed' as evidence of their virginity to prospective mates.

ox said...

@Athol Kay; Yes! If she can be honest, ashamed and hopeful of the future based on her relationship with Mashiach this is about as solid a foundation one can build on-truth. I will say that it is possible to regain the dignity of righteousness by building character. This is the summation of sanctification and redemption. The attempt to "regain virginity" is no more possible than the sinner saving them self. No can do! These psycho babble mental states are delusional mental gumnastics. Nevertheless this can indicate a deep desire for repentance. Good opportunity to set someone on the path of truth.

This could be a vague shimmering of impulses of the future:
1 And in that day seven women shall take hold of one man, saying, We will eat our own bread, and wear our own apparel: only let us be called by thy name, to take away our reproach.

Anonymous said...

If you are not her first you probably won't be her last (unless you're dating and she walks in front of a speeding bus). You are just a number beyond 1. There is the winner and losers. If you don't want to be a loser don't settle for and marry a slut. If you are an alpha then a non-virgin doesn't deserve you. If you are beta and she isn't a virgin then she's busy thinking about and pining for guys #1, #4, and #12 not you. You're just a wallet and eventual victim of divorce rape. Why take the chance?

finndistan said...

I know of the surgery, and it is quite common in places where men value virginity (more important, the men's mothers do)

But in the case that the date & time of the "first" time is known, there is also an easier way:

The "virgin" inserts fresh chicken liver into her vagina before the intercourse, and the husband* can enjoy deflowering the bride.

*In those places where virginity is valued, most men do not have extensive sexual experience, and that mainly with prostitutes or anal sex.

SarahsDaughter said...

Anonymous: In this age of feminism, your mentality will only lead you to Amish women.
It's reminiscent of the ludicrous notion of Muslim martyrs that expect 72 virgins to be meeting them in heaven whereas if there is one repentant Jenna Jamison waiting for them in heaven, they would be so much happier.

It's obvious you have emotional issues about womens' nature. I feel bad for you for the obvious pain that has been caused by our feminized culture. Hopefully you will be able to let go of that pain and realize that women are as forgivable of their sins as you are of yours.

LP2021 Bank of LP Work in Progress said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
LP2021 Bank of LP Work in Progress said...

Great post. 2nd time virgins in 2011? Talk about a guilt complex. I have heard of this in Christian circles. I feel very sad for those who must announce their 2nd chance virginity - it is a sign of seeking validation.

Dan in Philly said...

The last paragraph was very well said.

Happy Housewife said...

This brings back memories of a (formerly) good friend from college. She had an extensive sexual history dating back to junior high, and didn't really mind talking about it - that is, until she met a delta that had rich parents and was incredibly naive. I had thought it odd, at the time, that she lowered her standards in the looks department so much, but I know better now. She eventually told me that he was a virgin in all aspects - she was his first kiss - and even laughed at how awkward he was.

When I asked her if she was going to be honest with him about her past, her reply:

"I prayed to God about it all night, and He forgave me for everything. All my sins are washed away, it's like I'm a virgin again. So I don't have to tell [boyfriend] anything."

She ended up marrying the poor guy - he never saw it coming.

I hope she came clean with him at some point. They're (amazingly) still married now, 8 years later, so one could only hope. I certainly wouldn't want to stand before God someday and explain THAT.

zoegirl said...

@Amy - It's quite possible that he doesn't even want to know. If she wants to make this marriage last, then I see no reason for her to tell him. She is not bearing false witness by not revealing unsought information about her own past. God forgives and forgets. So should she.

Happy Housewife said...

@zoegirl - she told him she a virgin, when she wasn't. I'd call that bearing false witness.

zoegirl said...

@Amy..I misunderstood your comment. I thought that she just wasn't going to bring up her past because she had been forgiven. I'm still not sure that telling the truth now would be beneficial to anybody.

ox said...

It is perfectly reasonable for a female to be ashamed of a promiscuous past. Lying about it is not good. Building the relationship on a false premise is bad. Telling the truth can cause serious problems in a relationship.
I am a firm believer in the capacity of individuals to emerge out of a decadent society. Part of that emergence is maturity and strength of character. You have to "cowboy up" and reap what you sow sometimes. The true follower of Mashiach Yeshua has the added advantage of being forgiven and sanctified. They indeed become a new creature. But what they are in "the flesh" does not change. There will be plenty of virgins in hell by the way. And you judges who look down on the wreckage of a moribund world to relegate the sullied to a lesser marriage are doomed to share eternity with the whores. Virginity in and of itself is no ticket to heaven or any other paradise. It is a good thing for a woman to be a virgin. I know virgins who made hell on earth for their husbands too.

indyguy77@work said...

Well said, Ox.

I've done things I'd not want to admit to if a prospective bride asked. But I'd either fess up or tell her it's none of her business.

But I wouldn't lie. It just isn't worth it.

And if she dumped me for my truth or lack of truth forthcoming, so be it. She has the right (and duty, even) to do what's right for her and her future family.

modernguy said...

Some of you guys must have gone pretty far down the path of regret to accept such a quid pro quo of mutual ignorance . It's always amusing how "practical" men are so eager to turn a blind eye towards the past in order to get on with things. Interestingly they seem to keep doing things that require a "moving on" from them. So I guess it fits that the most important decisions a woman makes - the decisions that would most directly indicate the quality of her character - are the ones first up for avoidance and denial.

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