Tuesday, January 27, 2015

Tough Girls

Stingray explains the process by which women conclude they can beat up men just like Buffy and Xena:
I think it's innate. We see a strong woman beating up a man (this means that she is inherently better than him) and then we think, "Yeah! She did it, I identify with her, so I can do that, too!" It's not coherent like that. It's just a feeling. But that is basically the process.

It's female solipsism.
This no doubt explains the otherwise mysterious popularity of all the incredible warrior women over the last 20 years. Although it doesn't come close to replacing the conventional romance model, in which two Alphas battle over the right to be chosen by the reader representative

Feminists, of course, would like to see that trope transformed, so that Bella stakes the vampire, has the werewolf put down at the pound, and runs off with a woman who looks like Pete Rose.


Joshua Sinistar said...

Oh come on Vox lighten up. Men like Buffy and Xena too. Did you ever see the Xena episode where she defeats both Caesar and Pompey to save a village? Oh how I laughed! That's good stuff!

Black Poison Soul said...

I never did get the whole Xena crapola. Even though it was made here in New Zealand.

JCclimber said...

Pete Rose? How about the new female bishop of the Church of England?

Old Harry said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Heir to the Throne said...

and runs off with Lena Dunham

AmyJ said...

My dad was more into Xena than I was. I preferred Hercules..for obvious reasons...

Vincent Castrillo said...

Interesting observation VD. I've found that while men aren't entirely immune, women have innumerable bubbles that must be popped before they can be truly healthy, graceful, even feminine women and mothers.

Take the above for example. Most women have never been in any kind of fight or even physical altercation beyond a slap fest or hair pull in their entire lives. Much less a fight with a boy or a man. Because of this lack of awareness, many honestly don't see the full inbalance of power. They see fantasy and think, that could possibly happen. They see female cage fighters laughably scrapping with each other and think "surely they could kill the average guy at least" and so erroneously make life-threatening assumptions and hierarchies of force in their minds.

At some point in the future they might run into a smaller man at a club and think, I can hold my own against him, why don't I run my mouth and maybe slap him? They are always amazed when they wake up in the hospital or so shocked and appalled that menz rapez despite their absolute right to do anything they want anywhere they want with impunity.

Bubble burst. But unfortunately they don't do cautionary tales well, so they have to individually experience each catastrophe to learn. Female narcissism and all....

What you find is that this applies to most of life for women. Hence why we are in the situation we are in and why it is impossible to overcome until men realize females must be kept.

This simple. A society with any female input above wife and mother subservient to her husband is doomed to be overrun or mortally crippled by societal momentum. Want to know why we can't deal with even the simplest of problems? Even the lethal obvious ones? It's because not enough women "have experienced" it personally, despite it even being right in front of their faces.

Clinton was a genius for "I feel your pain"

macengr said...

I think there is more to it than that. Many men see these kind of women in games or movies and think they're super hot say, Lara Croft. Maybe, it's because they are comparing them to today's average woman, whose body type is far from athletic, I dunno. In any case, it's not just woman that love the trope of a hot babe with a sword kicking butt, however unrealistic it is. And it's not just women that believe it could be real. See Scalzi and other gammas.

SarahsDaughter said...

Because of this lack of awareness, many honestly don't see the full inbalance of power

And are clueless about how much it actually hurts. We just watched Alexander Gustafsson get pummeled by Anthony Johnson - seeing what Gustafsson went through puts the "women have a higher tolerance for pain 'cuz childbirth" theory into question.

Corvinus said...

Good points.

I don't think this Tough Girls thing is anything at all new, judging from the ancient Greek goddesses Athena and Artemis/Diana.

What bugs me about Xena/Buffy types is that they remind me too much of man-hating feminists. If they were the otherwise feminine sidekicks of a competent male leader, that would be better. Like in Burroughs' "A Fighting Man of Mars".

will said...

I always tell my girls that sports are separated to mens and womens because the women would never win. It's a fact and they know it. I also say it's not bad because women have other strengths, like making babies (up to 20 i tell them!)

Owen said...

Years ago, my 12 year old overpowered my ex, who was trying to put him in his place.

I don't know if it really sunk into her before, but she certainly had a wake-up call that day. For years, she could manipulate and use ultimatums and threatening language to get me to stay in line (pre-RP, very Churchian).

I'm sure she felt powerful...right up until she was pinned on the ground. She called me after and after sorting things out, I told her (away from him) that she was dumb to try to get physical with him and from that day forward he will only get bigger and stronger.

It is that false sense of "empowerment" that can get women into very dangerous situations. likewise, it's dangerous for men, or at least boys. I don't doubt if anything happens, even if she initiates, she'll call the police on him.

Natalie said...

This is why girls should grow up wrestling with their brothers/cousins/etc. When you're playing football in the backyard with your brothers you quickly realize that they are stronger and faster than you are. When you're the big sister that's an important piece of humble pie to swallow. As a result I never assume that I'm stronger than any guy I'm around and plan my activities accordingly. So moral of the story is that (in the proper context) wrestling with boys at a young age just might be a crucial ingredient in learning the truth about male/female relationships.

Laguna Beach Fogey said...

Nerds and geeks are surely also partly responsible for the rise of kick-ass warrior women.

Doom said...

I love when I meet such women. Just my raw size makes them question all of their heretofore surety. I'm old, mostly dead, but I still have a sense of being not only willing, but able, to take down any comers. Or at least give it a hell of a shot. These women realize that if they did something stupid, that I would punish them. If they have learned enough hand-to-hand combat to be dangerous, my response would most likely be lethal. And I honestly don't care. If not, they would merely get spanked, right on the spot.

Still, everyone needs fantasy. It's only when that fantasy puts them in danger that it might be called into question. The problem isn't with women's fantasies, or just with that, it's with guys who actually let them roll with it. Look such a woman right in the eyes and let her know she has not a chance in hell, if you are a guy and stumble on such. Even if she is bigger, she really doesn't stand a chance... unless you are a complete queer wienie who is completely adverse to any pain or confrontation. But you, if you are, don't count.

When families were larger, and parents had to let kids settle things up to a large point, girls learned early that they weren't equal. Through hard experience. Funny thing about the notion presented is that, as much as feminists neg physical capacity as a part of equality, they jump on it as soon as it seems as if they might be able to win, and include it. Not like we didn't know, just funny to see it exposed... if the author may be on the right side of the debate. Still, the observation is clear on the point, and is an observation of women so it counts.

Cataline Sergius said...

When you look at the great women warriors of history, you should ask what did they all have in common?

The answer is, they all died.

So we are not looking at a historical model here. We are looking at an entertainment trope.

Where did the tough girl fantasy start?

The answer is, with male writers. But I'm not sure why they invented the trope.

swiftfoxmark2 said...

My two year old nephew could probably take on his older step sister (she's 5). Fortunately, they haven't had a real fight yet, but I know that it's probably going to happen sooner or later. I just hope that my nephew shows some restraint.

And that my brother knows what to do in that situation.

swiftfoxmark2 said...

Also, my wife once told me how her older brother really punched her one time when they were younger. It was in the arm, but it really hurt her and she was shocked at just how strong he really was. She didn't hold it against him really because she had been punching him constantly before this in the arm after he told her to stop.

I guess that's a good rule of thumb for brothers and sisters. Always make sure your daughters know that men can easily overpower them, even if they are smaller or younger than them and make sure your sons know that girls and women are weaker and to show restraint or at least give them a fair warning.

mmaier2112 said...

I'm so glad my newest niece has two older brothers to pick on her. She should have no illusions by the time she's a teenager.

Cataline Sergius said...

Much as I hate to admit it. I know exactly where the tough girls trope started.

1980s Blue Science Fiction.

xandohsa said...

Joss Whedon has made a fortune with this tough girls schtick, and enjoyed an outsized influence in TV, film and comics. He's the leader of the pack on this effort to play up the girl power thing. Whedon is a self-professed believer in "womb envy", a theory that venerates women as superior to men, and he's a true believer, an activist. He would say that he is doing God's work on this, were he to believe in God, but he's an atheist and quite the activist on that front, too. What good little social justice warrior, this boy! His mission is to never let up on this, but rather to push this meme all day and all night long, torpedoes be damned.

Res Ipsa said...

Vincent Castrillo,

Good point. Most guys get into a fight with another guy, at least as boys. We have a generally good idea of how bad its going to hurt or what we can realistically do in a fight even if we aren't into martial arts. Women seem absolutely clueless about even the slightest use of force.

jimmy-jimbo said...

Women verbally beat up on men. They know intimidation. Then they wonder why no one will marry them.

standingagainsttheworld said...

Well currently looks like the secular Kurds are embroiled in that same delusion. They have women fighters in their ranks:
''When I ask if there are still women peshmerga in mountain bases, she says only with the Kurdistan Workers’ Party, the banned terrorist militia now fighting Isil and its Syrian offshoot, and the People’s Protection Units, which both have about 40 per cent female fighters. ''

And (with the help of US airstrikes and special ops) taking over ISIL territory.

Corvinus said...

In other news, short hair bites Jamaican beauty contestant in the a$$:


Kirk Parker said...


"Clinton was an evil genius for 'I feel your pain'."


Mastermind said...

Corvinus said...
What bugs me about Xena/Buffy types is that they remind me too much of man-hating feminists.

I wasn't much into Xena but I don't understand how anyone could watch Buffy and have her remind them of any feminist, let alone man-hating ones considering one of the recurring themes of the show was that she just wanted to be a normal girl who does girly things and her fate as the vampire slayer was completely unwanted (and at one point abandoned). In fact Buffy is a pretty good analogy in general for what feminists put normal girls/women through. It also speaks to Whedon's talent as an artist that despite his being a feminist pussy he wound up creating an excellent show, and I am constantly amused that he sees no parallel between what he did to Buffy and what he does to the girls who watch his show in general.

totenhenchen said...


I wouldn't kick her out of bed for eating a cracker...as long as that cracker was me.

JP said...

As far as warrior women in games go, it's not that I like them because they're women, it's because I like checking out a perfectly sculpted ass. Though given an everything-else-being-equal choice, I usually pick a dude (and play first-person mode because NO HOMO).

mmaier2112 said...

Dude... Miss Jamaica is not nearly as attractive as the winner. The dyke do doesn't help but come on here.

Dexter said...

When you look at the great women warriors of history, you should ask what did they all have in common?

The answer is, they all died.

They were there for their inspiring symbolic presence, not their actual combat ability.

Owen said...

Kurds use women because of numeric necessity. They simply don't have enough men to fight. Also, if captured, Kurdish women (regardless of combat status) are given no quarter. Might as well go down swinging.

Cataline Sergius said...

I suspect rather strongly, that the Kurds are using their women warriors simply as propaganda. They know perfectly well the western media will eat that shit up like it's candy.

YIH said...

Pete Rose? How about the new female bishop of the Church of England?
Vox covered that already complete with Not Safe For Stomach pic.
Black Poison Soul:
I never did get the whole Xena crapola. Me neither, I ain't into bulldykes, and more often than not the show was simply dull.

Joshua Sinistar said...

Oh come on. This grrl power delusion doesn't come from Wonder Woman, she's half naked wearing a swimsuit. These femininnies wouldn't be caught dead in a Xena or Wonder Woman costume. These warrior women are the only girls on TV who are allowed to have boyfriends anymore. The other "normal" females are Dunham Horrors out of a Stephen King Lovecraft rip-off.

PhantomZodak said...

i remember ridiculing my younger brother for watching buffy having never watched it. but then i walked into his room one day & saw her fighting spike. "that dude just punched that girl in the face! what are you watching" buffy he said to me grinning. i started watching for the choreographed fight scenes.

LAZ said...

" They see female cage fighters laughably scrapping with each other and think "surely they could kill the average guy at least"..."

Everybody I know that watches MMA is gaga over the women and cant understand why I don't like watching them. I keep telling them that I'd watch if these "professionals" could actually KO somebody. On the other hand, virtually every man that steps into that ring has the power to knockout another man.

stonesphinxes said...

That's why all women should do both strength training and some sort of co-ed grappling. One may grow, with great difficulty and focus, to be stronger than some men, but one will quickly find it's very far from most men. And those men can pass right by with a minimum of the same training.

It's an excellent reality injection, and good for you, of course.

CarpeOro said...

"Oh come on. This grrl power delusion doesn't come from Wonder Woman, she's half naked wearing a swimsuit. These femininnies wouldn't be caught dead in a Xena or Wonder Woman costume. These warrior women are the only girls on TV who are allowed to have boyfriends anymore. The other "normal" females are Dunham Horrors out of a Stephen King Lovecraft rip-off. "

Not from the original comic book Wonder Woman. I think there was even a discussion on VP in the past about the character being created by a male psychologist. She basically never won by physical prowess and would often get tied up with her own rope (which she could control, allowing her to get free). The current "equal of Superman" is a modern twist.

Rebecca Romijn seems caught up in the idea of playing the "tough grrl" since she was in the Xmen movies as a mutant. It is incredibly laughable seeing this once gorgeous woman defeating men on her last couple of tv shows.

925d0b70-a8ce-11e4-92ca-ebe8aac00aa2 said...

A few months ago, I was DJing at a club when I encountered a FemBeast. This woman was as tall as I was (well north of 6 foot), and was something like 350-400 lbs. She was confrontational and wore an expression that oozed hatred and disdain for her fellow humans.

When I first saw her, I knew it was going to be a long night. She was wrecking the vibe in the club -- nobody wanted her around -- and her girlfriend (a moderately attractive 6 or 7) was getting frustrated, because she, at least, wanted to have a good time. Anyone who even LOOKED at the 7 was immediately confronted by the FemBeast. Now, as a DJ, it is my JOB to watch the crowd and keep the vibe going. I tried not to look at the 7, as I really didn't want to deal with a FemBeast, but, inevitably, I looked. And the 7 got a little flirty with me, giving me the eyefuck. I didn't want her -- I don't want any woman contaminated by a FemBeast. But it didn't matter. I had awoken the beast's wrath.

The FemBeast declared that she wanted to fight me. I believe her exact words were "it's going to be so easy beating you up, little boy, 'cause I'm bigger than you." That much was obvious, but I'm not fearful of a lard bucket. She had this shit-eating grin, because she knew she had me in a bind. Fighting her and losing would be bad for obvious reasons, though I considered the possibility highly unlikely. Fighting her and winning would result in her pulling out the "you hit a woman" trump card, possibly even getting me fired. So I called over the bouncers. But they, too, were in a similar bind.

So after some conversation, the FemBeast returned to the bar and generally left me alone for the remainder of the night. But she had ruined the vibe, chased people out of the club, put the bouncers in a bad mood and basically fucked up the whole night for everyone, just with her mere presence. I was told that receipts were down 30% over the previous weekend. This is why, people, you don't let ugly FemBeasts into your club.

She wasn't a warrior woman, she was just a fat chunk of lard bringing a dump truck full of drama wherever she went. That is the furthest extent of Girl Power.

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