Saturday, January 2, 2016

Women warriors and the child-man

Dalrock explains why there are no longer any male rites of passage:
Mark Judge complains that weak men are screwing his Star Wars feminism up in ‘Star Wars’ and the Crisis of Masculinity (H/T Instapundit).  Judge postulates that the problem both in the movie and in real life is a lack of a male initiation ritual. There may be something to this, but there is a much more obvious problem in both Star Wars and the western world which Judge trips over while making his case for meaningful initiation rituals of manhood (emphasis mine):

    Yet young men who are not properly initiated can suffer from psychic dissonance, depression, rage, and a lifelong inability to handle relationships. In other words, they become like Kylo Ren. This is why the questions about Ren’s parentage are so fascinating. His parents, Han Solo and General Leia, are both strong warriors, yet their son seeks to test himself against a grandfather he never met. What went wrong?

Of course his mother and father are both strong warriors.  This is western fiction;  all princesses are now warriors.  It is mandatory.  Women have coveted the status of men, including their status as protectors.  For the most part women don’t actually want to take on the role, but they want to deny men of any sense of manly pride which might come with having such a defined obligation.  This is why all parts of our military need to be open to women, even the most elite and physically demanding roles.

The fundamental problem is not that we don’t have initiation rituals for men, but the reason why we can’t have them.  Initiation rituals are about defining manhood, especially the noble qualities of manhood.  This is something women en mass in the western world have demanded that we no longer do, because defining noble manhood confers the very manly pride women covet.
Women can't pass the tests. Ergo, the tests must go. That's what it boils down to in the end.

The answer? Ignore female demands for equality. Young men need challenges they can meet in order to transform from childish protectee to civilized protector.


Sokrates said...

If you can't fulfill a Standard, just abolish is! That's that loser's primitive logic.

Funkster411 said...

I wonder about kids born today, boys in particular, when they are 60 years old will they have reclaimed their rightful place as rulers of the West, or will they be slaves to the third world hurdes?

rumpole5 said...

"[W]ill they be slaves to the third world hurdes [sic]?" The fact is that the orc hordes lack the ability to enslave us. This is a contest between Europeans (including those in the new world and Australia) and other Europeans who are using the third world hordes as a tool against other Europeans.

rumpole5 said...

The “third world" is just a place to obtain resources. The hordes thereof are being used to weaken the bastion of Western Civilization in the same way that plague corpses were used to fling over the walls of besieged Constantinople.

Sir Thermite said...

Don't know how many times during my upbringing and since, that I've heard talk about teaching young men the virtue (and especially the "Christian" virtue) of "respecting women." For those of us who never had girls/women throwing themselves at us, and subsequently, haven't had much temptation to treat them as playthings...a much better message would have been to respect and emulate those who demonstrate masculinity. So what we have is a bunch of mincing white knights who pedestalize and rationalize the behavior of fallen women, while envying and judging for every minor fault the masculine red-pill men who succeed with women and should be role models.

liberranter said...

Young men need challenges they can meet in order to transform from childish protectee to civilized protector.

And women, young or old, need to start demonstrating that they merit protection other than by dint of possessing a vagina and an attitude of entitlement. Maybe --just maybe-- such a change in women for the better will kickstart a masculinity revival all by itself. I'm not holding my breath for either one to happen.

Natalie said...

@Sir Thermite - I was once at a highly conservative event (not cuckservative - I'm talking old school), and I got the double impression that any of the men there would have cheerfully thrown themselves between me and a bullet and yet didn't give a damn about my opinions. I was a mother with her children. Therefore I would be protected. They didn't need to coddle me or solicit my input or even really acknowledge me. It's respect that elevates men themselves without putting the women at the center of the universe. (I really never felt more like "a mother with her children" than at that event. Who I was didn't particularly matter but me safely fulfilling my role did.)

Happy Housewife said...

I mentioned to my husband yesterday that I, and other women I've known, often wondered what life would have looked like had we been born men. He said men don't wonder what their lives would have been like had they been born women. It's just not a thought that occurs to them.

It's interesting that it goes one way. I wonder why?

David-093 said...

Happy Housewife:

Men are made, women are born. And both know this.

frenchy said...

You rip a culture's rite of passage out of its young men, and they will seek criminal means to fulfill it.

Dexter said...

"General" Leia is incompetent as a general, a politician, and as a warrior.

Sir Thermite said...

@ Natalie

I think we're talking about two different things. "Respecting women" != Protecting mothers with their children. A man's willingness to lay down his life to protect a woman whom some other man has clearly already bedded, and whose offspring are carrying another man's entirely different than being taught to give single, childless females the respect and deference that he'd never give to a male unless it was earned. Or as I was saying, such men go even farther and give women *more* respect than the masculine role models whom women actually do respect.

Jack Amok said...

Sir Thermite,

It's one and the same thing - the idea is a man would protect his own wife, children, sisters, etc., (from assault as well as attempted corruption) but if he wasn't around at the moment, his compatriots would accept the burden on his behalf. I will defend your home if you are out, and you will defend mine when I am absent.

It's a system that relies on a lot of assumptions our society has cast aside.

Cataline Sergius said...

You can still find a manhood ceremony if you know where to look.

Prime example: The Marine Corps Recruit Training Crucible.

"Recruits get eight hours of sleep during the entire 54 hour exercise, They get two-and-a-half MREs and they are responsible for rationing out the food to themselves. Then we put them through tough physical activities like road marches and night infiltration courses. They march about 40 miles in those 54 hours."

Honestly I'm amazed that the Marine Corps has been allowed to keep Bootcamp segregated by sex. If Hillary is elected I suspect that will go as well.

For the moment America's Worst Secretary of Defense appears to be unaware of it.

Timmy3 said...

Obviously, a man that doesn't need to protect women doesn't need a rite of passage. She rejects a protector. The guy can tell her to screw herself and she does.

Michael Maier said...

"General" Leia is incompetent as a general, a politician, and as a warrior.

Seemingly as a wife and mother too.

Unknown said...

Happy Housewife, reread Genesis 3. "Your desire shall be for your husband..." seems to cover a multitude of sins.

dc.sunsets said...

Excellence in fathering includes showing sons what manhood entails, and provides mile markers for identifying status as an adult man. Those who believe 2+ years in the military are necessary to confer manhood are mistaken.

Ron said...

Alternatively, the demand to get rid of the test, is the test.

Cataline Sergius said...

Honestly the Marine Corps Study on women in combat that went on for over a year is way worse than what you heard about.

You would not believe the amount of women who were outright broken out of the service and discharged for medical conditions.

Most of it was hip injuries of course. But the rest that got sent home, were broken out of the military due to psych evals.

And everyone involved in the study knew...absolutely knew the entire thing was going to be completely pointless. The Obamabots at DOD were doubling down before the study was even started.


Aeoli Pera said...

Young men need challenges they can meet in order to transform from childish protectee to civilized protector.

Sit down, shut up, and study for the SATs. Don't breathe too loud or we'll put you on SSRIs.

Aeoli Pera said...

Heh, just realized after writing that we've replaced the three R's with the three S's.


Sit down
Shut up

tz said...

Women have an internal conflict in modern society.
They aren't "grizzly", at least in strength but have the protective instinct.
Yet they reject finding a man as protector (which is aligned with human masculine instincts).
So they can never feel safe. They cannot become some kind of "Amazon warrior" capable of protecting their babies. They refuse to find and mate with Men who would have little problem protecting them and their babies.
So they retreat into fictional fantasy where women can do in those realms that which is impossible in this real world.

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