Female country music stars are accusing country music consultant Keith Hill of discriminating against women after he advised stations to play fewer songs by female artists. Hill, who calls himself “the world’s leading authority on music scheduling,” made the comments to Country Aircheck Weekly.Always. Even if it means that those female singers and songwriters will have smaller audiences and make less money. Never mind what the numbers say. Never mind what the people motivated by maximizing profit say. Obviously a bigger piece of a smaller pie is better for all women, right?
“They’re just not the lettuce in our salad,” he said. “The lettuce is Luke Bryan and Blake Shelton, Keith Urban and artists like that. The tomatoes of our salad are the females.”
But he insisted he is not being sexist.
“In a deep irony, it’s the demand of female listeners who aren’t thinking about it. They’re just responding to that flow of song after song, and if that mix has more females in it, they turn off quicker,” explained Hill. He added, “My stations win by taking females out. Sometimes that’s enough to go from the number three station to the number one station in a market.”
One of the first to speak out was country music star Miranda Lambert, using a common expletive that describes bovine fecal matter to explain how she felt about Hill’s statement. She took to Twitter:
I am gonna do everything in my power to support and promote female singer/songwriters in country music. Always.
— Miranda Lambert (@mirandalambert) May 28, 2015
Women hate objective measures. After all, it should be easy enough for them to prove Hill wrong. Just play all female country all the time. Why don't they do that?
47 comments:
And yet, no shaming of women and men who dislike female country singers.
I wonder what Dolly Parton has to say about all of this?
I can't listen to an audiobook as long if the speaker is female. Even if she does a good job, and the voice fits because the protagonist is female, it's simply a fact that the higher pitch of a woman's voice tends to grate over time and wear on your nerves. Men's lower voices are more soothing and easier to listen to for an extended time. This guy is exactly right: good women singers may sound great in small doses, but they need to be mixed into a regular diet of men's voices to let the ear rest, otherwise people will change the channel in self-defense.
It doesn't help that so many girl singers are selected for their looks first and their voices second, so their voices aren't that great in the first place. Many of them are just yelling.
I can't stand country music anyway so by all means go ahead and play only women.
When it comes to feminism, facts truly don't matter.
Miranda isn't as special a snowflake as she thought.
I don't know how much this will help as Taylor swift has already done so much damage country may never recover.
Ah, commentary from Miranda Lambert, the adulterous psycho who makes her money by singing about being a crazy ex. Truly she is someone people will take seriously.
I am gonna do everything in my power to support and promote female singer/songwriters in country music.
Promote them to whom?
Pandora is great - it never makes me listen to female singers. I did have to train it to stop playing the Beatles though.
The conflict is amusing. On one hand Keith Hill wants to do exactly what female listeners want and give them a mostly male line up of music. On the other hand female performers DEMAND doing exactly the opposite of what the consumers want. What was that about women ruining everything?
Vox asks: "Why don't they do that?"
Because of the "patriarchy", duh. Talk about an easy pitch :P
I don't get the economics of this. At some point, the songs get enough exposure on the radio for audiences to form an opinion, "hey, I need to buy that off ITunes when I get home" or "I am going to google her next concert venue and buy some tickets". I suggest that the level of exposure needed is quite a bit less than what the underexposed females are currently getting, so less esposure is not in fact harming them in any measurable way. Further, there is a maximum exposure before the audience threatens to take hostages if they hear it even one more time. Radio stations back in the 90's used to play the same ten songs over and over and over. part of teh reason why Rush Limbaugh took over 600 AM radio stations. listeners were tired of the same ten songs on FM.
And I judge all Female Country music tallent by whether or not I would do her if I had the chance. Yes, I have some of Lambert's songs.
Miranda Lambert, the adulterous psycho
Go on...
There was a change, from Alison Krauss's I love my man songs to all this new "Fuck you I'mma burn your house down" shit that nobody wants to hear. Same reason nobody with undyed hair listens to Pink. Now maybe we can get this Hill guy to speak truth to TV stations about how infuriating female football announcers are.
I instinctively not listen to female country music although I do listen to Carrie Underwood as the exception. Country music is about partying and drinking beer as the beverage of choice. Men do those things better.
Isn't this the same opportunity costs problem you were writing about at VP the other day?
~ Stingray
Incidentally, Miranda Lambert is the only female country singer I listen to, since my wife has her CD's loaded up in her car. Myself, I prefer the Hag.
"It doesn't help that so many girl singers are selected for their looks first and their voices second, so their voices aren't that great in the first place. Many of them are just yelling."
I think musicians in general are selected more for their looks than raw talent nowadays (see also: all the "pretty" boy bands with zero musical ability).
Music was better when they allowed ugly people to make it.
What Cail said about female singers' voices being more annoying, along with the fact that the lyrics of the female singers' songs themselves aren't as good as those composed by men.
"I don't know how much this will help as Taylor swift has already done so much damage country may never recover. "
Pop country has been atrocious for quite a while now. I don't know her music, but it's difficult to see how she could have made it any worse.
Obviously a bigger piece of a smaller pie is better for all women, right?
And therein lies the problem that can ultimately destroy democracies. The thing is, it might actually be better for a good number of people to have a big piece of a small pie than to have a small piece of a big pie. It all depends on the exact numbers involved. The ones who are protesting are the current big name stars. They probably do stand to lose by having their songs played less - since their per-play royalty rates are determined by law and not by the market. If their songs go out of rotation, they lose.
Always, always, always follow the money. Whenever some rich assholes are promoting a cause, no matter how seriously they seem to believe in it, it always comes back to lining their own pockets.
Carrie Underwood is pretty amazing though. Her rendition of Neon Moon puts the original to shame.
The big question is, who is turning off the station? Men or women?
I didn't even have to read the article and I knew the answer.
Read the actual article and...surprises, surprise, it's women turning off women.
Women who like country music are way more competitive than the fat purple hair dyed, moonflakes that listen to the caterwauling lesbians on Sirius Coffee House.
Yes, female country listeners might like and identify with one female singer in four but those other four are, "just plain trash," so far as they are concerned. And they will reaching for dial in irritation as soon as they hear, the first bars of song by some girl they don't like.
Game 101: A Misogynist is a man who hates women almost half as much, as women hate each other.
It sounds just like how BBC comedy panels now must have at least one female guest. Then they complained because most of the female guests weren't 'given a chance' because they didn't jump into the conversation as the men did.
Now the panels are purposely stopping the conversation to ask them what they think to make sure they're heard.
Seriously, one minute it's "women are as good if not better than men", the next is "the format is too masculine and needs to be toned down to make sure women feel included".
Talk about having your cake and eating it too.
Reminds me of when a relative who's a public library manager told me some of her female patrons have openly stated they're not interested in books by female authors because they don't think they'll be written as well.
Men write songs FOR women. Women write songs ABOUT men. - Rollo Tommasi
Wait a minute......Women are switching channels when there's too much whining? Thanks for the grins.
Notice she mentioned promoting female songwriters, when that wasn't an issue. Personally I don't care if the music is written by bullfrogs as long as it's good. Side note to you old school guys, Hill got away with callling women tomatoes and the women didn't notice.
Country music today is simply about all the male artists who can be marketed and played on the radio women want to f*ck. Period. Musicianship and vocal talent is very few and far between. It's all about marketing and how many drunk women will throw themselves (and their money) at the feet of these men in hopes of landing in bed with one of them. As a jock, I see it at EVERY concert I attend.
^^^proving once again that WRE.
It doesn't help that so many girl singers are selected for their looks first and their voices second, so their voices aren't that great in the first place. Many of them are just yelling.
I ran across a tune by a Japanese girl band that sort of hooked me, so I looked them up (can't remember the name of the band now). What I found is polished studio work and absolute garbage on the live clips. They literally couldn't hold a tune.
It occurred to me then producers probably don't care at all whether they can sing - you can fix pretty much anything in post production these days. Or you can use studio musicians. Looks are everything.
Women hate objective measures.
They don't much like other women either, as Cataline mentioned.
Funny, listening to a pop music station for a while, all the female singers sounded exactly alike. But all the songs sung by male vocalists were distinct, even though half of them were sung by Pharrell.
Another disaster of feminism. No the man in question didn't say anything wrong, he was being honest and thinking about something called R-A-T-I-N-G-S, stats, listenership, women often dont understand those things. How many women are in radio as program directors or lead song list analysts? Few, its mostly the men running the show.
Women dont even belong in music to begin with, if its not Rene Fleming or an extraordinary talent in pop/rock, music should be left to the men to produce.
I have never or rarely enjoyed ladies vocals in post american days going back to 20 years ago. Too high, too emo, too annoying, too weird. Now Japanese or Korean or other foreign womens music is a different matter, same topics like love, joy, sadness, etc., but they actually have talent if one seeks their music out versus having all this solipsism thrown at us stateside. Our local pool had to play country music, I dont care, I block it out, my instanta reaction to country was to grab my noose.
Women shrieking, "dat dont impressa me enough." Lady, we are all aging and going to die one day, stop trashing men.
(Canadian) Avril Lavinge? She doesn't trash men, she builds them up celebrates them, overall, married, (can keep a man), rational and can even pull off song/music video/hello kitty - no matter what audience it played to Avril celebrates men. So often in womens music they trash men and I wont buy or listen to their trash. I began the rejection of gen x music around 1994.
I hated, hated the music not the person probably pushed into whatever via records company controls. The poison boomers/neoconns, perverts and terrible song writing (of self destruction, feminism and warped relations between men and women) have filled gen x with has such terrible consequences I doubt my own capacity to even explain it. I think its time to shut up and get some rest.
Not that Gilby Clark doesn't like women, one of his best solo songs was something baby wont you shut up, shut up, its a sweet kind song not meant mean but the man has a point!
Edit: something like, "baby wont you shut up, shut up" its from 1993 or 1994's Pawnshop Guitars. His first song on the CD was prophetic.
"I am gonna do everything in my power to support and promote female singer/songwriters in country music. Always."
Not support and promote merit, excellence, and achievement in songwriting and music. Which benefits the larger good. Ms. Lambert will support Team Fem. No matter what. The personal isn't merely political. The personal is art, it's relationship, it's panoptic and totalitarian. There's no escape from it and Miranda and friends are here to tell us what we're allowed personally and what we aren't.
Which is why Miranda Lambert (whoever she is) must not be allowed to have any power. Else she will abuse it for selfish ends, then call self-service 'good'.
Considering the evidence of the past few decades, anybody who wishes to be allowed anything personal in future (to say nothing of things meritorious or beautiful) might want to speak up soon.
I've never met a maranda lambert fan who wasn't a drunk and at least fifty percent sassy bitch.
Thank for calling me a drunk and a 50% sassy bitch LOL. Hill might be right, I wouldn't be surprised by that. On the other hand, Lambert is very talented as a singer, songwriter and actress (on stage). She puts on a great, fun show and played to a sold out MSG this spring. She's also half crazy, but not exactly unusual for big country or rock stars. It makes sense that she would speak out for other women. That doesn't make her right.
Half crazy, all HAWT.
Eric said...
It doesn't help that so many girl singers are selected for their looks first and their voices second, so their voices aren't that great in the first place. Many of them are just yelling.
I ran across a tune by a Japanese girl band that sort of hooked me, so I looked them up (can't remember the name of the band now). What I found is polished studio work and absolute garbage on the live clips. They literally couldn't hold a tune.
It occurred to me then producers probably don't care at all whether they can sing - you can fix pretty much anything in post production these days. Or you can use studio musicians. Looks are everything.
Live singing doesn't mean anything either. They have Autotune in rack gear and even pedals now. And that's IF they're actually singing live.
My gripe with many singers these days (like Brad Paisley) is that they're too busy running around for the SHOW part and get so winded they cannot sing. BP doesn't fake it but it detracts from the performance, IMO. But I like substance more than flash.
I dig this chick for country. She can wail on a geetar and her vocals feel honest: https://www.youtube.com/user/TheOfficialIamHayley
Grendel, thumbs up on the Alison Krauss point. Trouble is, Alison is so much a cut above the rest that's she's essentially in a class by herself. She's that good, truly one of a kind - those 27 Grammys she's won so far are no accident (more than any other singer male or female).
The Who's Pete Townshend once made an interesting comment on this topic, in response to the question, "How come The Who has so few love songs?" Townshend's answer was that he purposely avoided them. He consciously pursued a male fan base and simply was not interested in catering to the girls in the slightest. Of course, it came out later that Pete is a homosexual, and that maybe figured into his desires, but he explained it in business and artistic terms. He thought it was more honest, and easier, not to be continually beholden to female tastes and fancies. And he didn't want The Who to be a fad. He set out to win over the boys intentionally, thinking that they'd be more loyal fans and easier for him to relate to. And, as a bonus, he realized if you win over all the boys then the girls will follow. So Townshend's then surprising advice to struggling bands was, at one point, "Ignore the girls."
I love country music. Unfortunately all of the singers I like are either old, obscure, dead or Japanese. That's why my MP3 player has Waylon Jennings, followed by Robert Earl Keen and various assorted Japanese songs from anime. Seriously, this modern watered down feminized sing through a computer box crap makes me puke. In modern country music all of the songs are the same:
1. Female singer: singing about how much grrrrrrl power she has and isn't going to take any crap.
2. Male singer: blubbering on about how he doesn't deserve such a wonderful girl as her.
Utter. Complete. Garbage. It's like they don't market the music for anyone but manjinas and teen girls. I'll pass. I still have my old music and singers like Chris Knight and Kokia.
The new Chicago area station has this format, less chicks.
The gyms plays country from time to time, most of the songs are men worshiping women or women trashing men.
Awful. If I listened to it I'd lose my temper same for PopHoeEmoTrash.
2. Male singer: blubbering on about how he doesn't deserve such a wonderful girl as her.
Or... "I was drunk, the day my mother, got out of prison...."
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