[T]he insanity of the modern Christian position on out of wedlock births is so great that it is tempting to forget just how incredibly foolish it is. It is difficult to process the fact that our leaders are so eager to excuse the rampant sinful and catastrophic choices women are making, choices which have lead us to a state where over forty percent of children are now born out of wedlock.Men are not the problem in the modern Church. They can't be; they're not even there. The problem is one that was identified nearly 2,000 years ago by the Apostle Paul, who also provided the antidote. Show me a church that has female pastors and I'll show you a church that will deny the literal resurrection of Jesus Christ within 50 years.
Except for the minuscule fraction of out of wedlock births due to rape, every single out of wedlock birth represents a case where a woman chose to bear a child by a man who wasn’t interested in marrying her or a man she wasn’t interested in marrying. We also know that the choice of unfit fathers isn’t random. This is exactly the kind of men women who are thinking with their genitals will choose.
Yet Christian men, especially Christian leaders, can’t bring themselves to call out this pervasive sin which is harming countless millions of children. In fact, when an actress and single mother wrote a book touting the benefits of fatherless children, The 700 Club not only failed to call her out for her own sin and encouragement to other women to sin, they plugged the book.
When single mothers are more revered than the Virgin Mary, when the brave act of raising a little bastard or three is more lionized than the Magnificat, that is a certain sign that a church is spiritually dead. Leave it behind and don't look back.
38 comments:
Show me a church that has female pastors and I'll show you a church that will deny the literal resurrection of Jesus Christ within 50 years.
It's just as likely to be the other way around. Best to avoid both.
It's no accident that, once a church allows female pastors, they gradually replace the men. And the men who stick it out tend not to be the manliest, generally.
Even in the Catholic Church, where women cannot be priests, modernist parishes will have lay women running many of the day-to-day operations and committees, while the priest does little more than confer the sacraments. And people in those parishes like it that way.
Even in the Catholic Church, where women cannot be priests, modernist parishes will have lay women running many of the day-to-day operations and committees, while the priest does little more than confer the sacraments.
The local Catholic church has a school attached. The school employs precisely two men: the janitor and the cook. The parish office employs NO men.
I remember the first time I saw a female pastor when I was a teen years ago in a mainline church. Maybe I was the only one who felt that way there, but it felt extremely off to me. A few years later, I was viewing a video created by the church in support of Liberation Theology types in Nicaragua. Year later I had ceased attending that church in favor of a Menonnite off-shoot church. I read about the church discussing the ordination of gay pastors or some such evil. I was mad enough that I went to my old church and asked them to strike me from their books officially. I wanted no ties at all to it.
I had always wondered about the time frame from certain leading indicators of rebellion against God to outright apostasy. Do you have any data or study that demonstrates a 50 year time frame? It would be pretty useful to me.
Not that I disagree with the sentiment here but the United Methodist church has been ordaining women since the 20s.
Yeah, the Methodists have been one of the more "progressive" denominations for a long time.
The scare-quotes are confusing me.
I hate to do this, but let's be cynical.
The church is an organization. It sells a product and get things in return (donations, social status for the leadership, etc).
Who are the customers? Women, especially women whose lives are falling apart because of their choices, have ALWAYS been good customers for the church.
50 years? You are ever the optimist. Anything longer than 50 weeks will be an outlier.
To be fair, most churches that name female pastors are churches that have denied the literal resurrection long before.
Give her a little credit for not having an abortion.
that is a certain sign that a church is spiritually dead. , No, it is far worse. It means it is actually a congregation of Satan (see Revelation 2-3). Were it merely dead, it would only have a small threat of infection. This is like spreading anthrax spores.
I know of two Catholic Churches that are a bit legalistic, but they have no shortage of altar boys and vocations. They have no altar-girls, eucharistic ministers (no church where I've been that has them limits it to men).
Also women might not deny the literal resurrection of Christ (they will simply deny it has any real meaning), but will do things like ordain lesbian Bishop-esses.
And another repeat of the observation that all the churches seem to be in an utter tizzy about "gay marriage" will allow any number of divorces and remarriages, the "single mothers" from divorce or separation, etc.
Given the choice, I would have Gay Marriage legal across the board but "no-fault" or "man-fault" divorce completely banned. Our culture can survive the former but the latter is actively destroying us daily - and the church - even the Catholic Church (e.g. http://www.portlanddiocese.org/docs/2449.StatementfromBishopMaloneontheElectionOct.25.pdf - see if you can see anything about divorce).
In a nutshell, it boils down to two things. First and foremost the church should always embrace REPENTANT sinners, be they single mothers, sodomites, drunkards, gossips, murderers, gluttons, etc. The key is repentance.
Second, the qualifications for leadership is husband of one wife with well behaved children. I am divorced and remarried and I struggle with whether I should be allowed to be in the miniscule role of worship band drummer due to my status of being divorced. It's not legalism - it reflects a potential character flaw that could lead others astray.
I have the same concerns about unwed mothers. What ever their reason for being unwed mothers, if they haven't repented, they shouldn't be allowed to serve in the church. If they have repented, they should never be allowed to be in leadership, regardless of how you may feel about women pastors.
"Give her a little credit for not having an abortion."
How sad that NOT murdering your own baby should be "given credit"...
One is reminded of Chris Rock and how he heard men saying "I take CARE of my kids!"
My in-laws are Episcopalian and appear to be blinding themselves to its slow death. Despite their extreme, Glenn Beck "conservatism", they both have zero problems with females leading the church and openly embrace it. The one they attend is tiny, pipes in organ music from the larger church in near-by Tulsa, and barely has any funds to keep running. It is in its death throes, which they both reluctantly recognize, but for some reason will not jump ship, despite the fact that all of their children have chosen non-denom. faiths over what they were raised with.
My father-in-law was saying that they'd had a female pastor (priest?) for a while, and, according to him, almost all of the men stopped attending. She left after a brief stint, probably due to the poor attendance, the church got a male pastor, and - magically - attendance was back to where it was.
The salient point sailed over both of their heads and I didn't have the heart to point it out to them.
We also know that the choice of unfit fathers isn’t random.
It also isn't limited to unmarried mothers.
Before I met her, my wife had been married twice and had three other live-in relationships. She could have had a kid with any of these five men.
Her first husband was an engineering graduate, and a brilliant entrepreneur who was well on his way to his first million while they were married; his net worth is now probably nine figures.
One of the live-ins came from a family which owns a large fraction of the island of Kauai. The other two, while not super-rich, were well-off, accomplished professionals.
Her second husband was a high-school dropout, an alcoholic and heavily into cocaine.
Guess which one she had a kid with. (Hint: the kid's IQ is in the low 80's.)
A church I drive by has a sign out advertising support for people going through divorce. I think it says "Divorce Care Support". I don't attend church myself but I was struck by the fact that the stigma of divorce is gone and the now the church is instead actively courting those going through a divorce.
"Even in the Catholic Church, where women cannot be priests, modernist parishes will have lay women running many of the day-to-day operations and committees, while the priest does little more than confer the sacraments. And people in those parishes like it that way."
It is bad when they are in charge of liturgy and catechesis.
"A church I drive by has a sign out advertising support for people going through divorce. I think it says "Divorce Care Support". I don't attend church myself but I was struck by the fact that the stigma of divorce is gone and the now the church is instead actively courting those going through a divorce." - Anon
Good churches are hospitals and should be reaching out and reflecting the Good News into the culture. When people are suffering is when they are most open to change and especially the abandoned spouse needs godly counsel.
But one must minister and lead to repentance without sanctioning the sin. The church is in the people business and the people business is a messy business.
This condition is pervasive in the modern church and it's no surprise when you have men like Gilbert Bilezikian writing books full of tortured logic, purporting to find full equality in the sexes in the scriptural text.
In Bilezikian's world the serpent approached Eve because she was more able to resist and, on the next page, he excused Eve's sin by stating that she wasn't as prepared as Adam because he'd heard directly from God regarding the tree, while she'd only heard from Adam. Which was it Gilbert?
Along the same line, Paul only restricted women because women of that day weren't prepared to minister and Paul wouldn't let any unprepared person minister, but once these unprepared men and women are sufficiently trained, it's all good and they should be ordained.
And on and on and on from this Wheaton professor and founder of Willow Creek.
Strangely wrong. For all of history, society has had unwed mothers - widows, war victims (rape and pillaging). The Bible notes the importance of donating money to support widows and orphans.
How modern welfare is administered is the problem. 1 - it takes the stigma out of being husbandless, and 2 - gratitude isn't offered or required.
@dustydog - Be careful to avoid the modern snare of trying to conflate the dignity of widowhood with the open sin of unwed motherhood, whoredom, and frivorce.
As you can see from the chart @ Dalrock's, widowhood is a very small sliver of the pie. Too many churches want to pretend "single mother" (unwed/divorced/or widowed) is the modern extension of widow, because there are orders to protect the widow who cannot fend for herself.
Note that there's a suggestion from Paul that, if the widow is young, to prevent her from slipping into sin, she really should remarry, as there is no adultery in marrying the wife of a dead man, and so it is in fact the aged widows that were the ones most directly provided for by the church congregation.
Strangely wrong. For all of history, society has had unwed mothers - widows, war victims (rape and pillaging). The Bible notes the importance of donating money to support widows and orphans.
Okay.
O-kay.
My great-aunt's husband died shortly after he got her pregnant. She had to raise twins without him (though, thank God, she had lots of help from his family). She was a widow raising orphans, and she did a wonderful job of it; her kids are good, upstanding people and I am proud to know them.
You do NOT lump her in with my slut second-cousin who's got three kids by as many men, one of them conceived while she was working as a prostitute.
Because lumping them together is not so strangely wrong.
My guess is these false pastors are just playing the tune their audience wants to hear. Their congregations are shrinking and the only people they're able to attract are sponge mothers who are all to eager to shriek or cut and run if they hear something they don't like.
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Looks like yet another of these is about to be foisted upon the world. Last night, my wife all but asked for a divorce. It was more of a passive-aggressive "We need to pick a direction", but "honor our vows and make it work", one of the possible choices, is not considered favorable to her.
Turns out, her supposedly "Christian" friend (neither of them goes to church because it doesn't make them haaaaaaaappy) is one of the loudest voices urging her to divorce me.
In Bilezikian's world the serpent approached Eve because she was more able to resist and, on the next page, he excused Eve's sin by stating that she wasn't as prepared as Adam because he'd heard directly from God regarding the tree, while she'd only heard from Adam. Which was it Gilbert?
Funny, just yesterday I was reading The Ante-Nicene Fathers and found pretty much this same belief from St. Irenaeus, around 180 AD:
--
Why also did it not prefer to make its attack upon the man instead of the woman? And if thou sayest that it attacked her as being the weaker of the two, [I reply that], on the contrary, she was the stronger, since she appears to have been the helper of the man in the transgression of the commandment. For she did by herself alone resist the serpent, and it was after holding out for a while and making opposition that she ate of the tree, being circumvented by craft; whereas Adam, making no fight whatever, nor refusal, partook of the fruit handed to him by the woman, which is an indication of the utmost imbecility and effeminacy of mind. And the woman indeed, having been vanquished in the contest by a demon, is deserving of pardon; but Adam shall deserve none, for he was worsted by a woman,--he who, in his own person, had received the command from God.
--
^ The authenticity of that fragment is doubtful? From a footnote: "From the contemplations of Anastasius Sinaita, who flourished A.D. 685. Harvey doubts as to this fragment being a genuine production of Irenaeus; and its whole style of reasoning confirms the suspicion."
Yeah, didn't notice that, since I was looking for their opinion on a completely other thing, and this just happened to stick out in my text search.
To paraphrase (what may or may not be) Irenaeus: "Eve was stronger, smarter, and more resolute - she just couldn't help herself! And Adam; what a faggish dolt - he was bested by a dumb woman."
It's like Walt from Gran Torino with a female hamster running furiously at the wheel.
and I personally know a pastor from an AME church that says that fatherlessness in the black community is OK because "Jesus was fatherless".
Yea, right. right out of the south end of a north bound male bovine.
The sanctification of the single mother started a while back on the left (am I dating myself if I mention "Murphy Brown") but I first realized it had permeated the right when Sarah Palin hit the national scene.
I was startled at how she could parade (with the help of the MSM) her daughter and single mom Bristol with nary a tut tut about child out of wedlock. Instead we just got the message that Bristol is a role model because she didn't have an abortion. I'm surprised only one commenter above this has mentioned abortion as one reason for this sanctification.
It's as if somehow we obsess so much on one sin that we lose all sight of the others. To prevent one wavering pregnant teen from getting an abortion, we are afraid to scold or shame any out of wedlock pregnancy.
This problem stems from the conflict between their anti-abortion stance and single motherhood. One side has to give in.
Society has taken us to this path. The church simply followed.
This topic reminded me of another ancient post from a different Christian website. Over there, I said I would never date a single mother. He countered that this makes me pro-abortion. I didn't think it was worth the rebuttal, but now I realized he was on to something. Apparently, he felt he could save a single mother, while at the same time, give the bastard children a step-father.
In later posts where he described his situation, his relationship with the single mother that he was dating didn't successfully result in a marriage. Thus, he failed in his objectives. He had some regrets, but I warned him that there were plenty of single women that didn't have kids. He would be starting from a better position than this.
Single mothers don't abort their kids. A Christian man should have no culpability if he chooses to avoid such women. Single women likely had great sex with their lovers. Their past lovers made a great impression on them. They were in all intents and purposes, planning on having long term relationships with them, but those plans went south. Both made mistakes. It is horrible to not provide a father figure for the kids. The kids are likely to live in poverty and an emotionally unstable household.
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